Dame Sally Davies (notes from a BBC interview)
/In this post, there is a list of the advanced words and phrases from the BBC Radio 4 Desert Island Discs interview with Dame Sally Davies. She is the chief medical officer of England. Aggie and I are currently creating a podcast (in which we will explain some of the words) and it will be launched on 11th October!
You can listen to the interview here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m000746z
INTRO BY LL
Chief medical officer of England
Most senior advisor to the government on medicine and public health
0:54 Her day job is not for the faint hearted
0:57 As well as getting politicians to get behind evidence based health policies that won’t necessarily make them more popular
Obesity crisis, antimicrobial resistance
1:12 Also responsible for the UK’s response to epidemics like bird flu and ebola
1:18 Developed a reputation for speaking her mind and for making things happen
1:22 As a haematologist she pioneered improvements in care for sickle cell…
Set up the National Institute for Health Research
1:31 Reorganising how the research was funded in the NHS
1:34 She puts her organisation down to her upbringing
→ Parents: theologian and scientist
1:42 Progress and ethical considerations were equally important
More interested in influence than in power
CHANGE OUR BEHAVIOUR
2 ways to do this
2:07 One is structural, seatbelts, banning smoking in public places, taxes….
2:12 The other is nudging
At the supermarket, take things that are easiest to take
Which prefer? Need combination of both
2:36 Think what we’re trying to counteract
Commercial people Spending millions on marketing unhealthy foods
2:52 How receptive are politicians [LL]
3:02 They may not be vote-winners (the advice)
Took 50 years for us to understand the damage that tobacco does, but took 20 years or more to actually achieve ban on smoking
3:25 You’re remarkable for your formidable energy levels
HOW TO RELAX
3:33 Go out jogging a couple of days a week
3:39 I have to practice what I preach and I do find I feel better for it
3:44 My family joke I have an on switch and an off switch
Wanted to be a violinist, now goes to lots of operas
4:01 To wind down, yes I like concerts
FIRST DISC (VAUGHN WILLIAMS)
Piece she played
4:13 I played the viola in the Midland Youth Orchestra
4:19 The depth and beauty of it, it’s wonderful
CHILDHOOD
Didn’t enjoy school, failed 11+
5:52 I had chamber music
5:56 And on a Sunday afternoon I went sailing
5:58 My mother had a little sailing dinghy, and my sister crewed for her
Sailing races in the afternoon, even if it was snowing! Would sing ‘Nobody knows how cold my toes are’ !
PARENTS
6:23 Mother was a very strong character
1st Gen University students
6:32 Studied natural sciences before they gave degrees to women
6:41 7 Bus loads of old bats who got their degrees in the 90s
Father not a frequent church goer
7:04 Even that petered out
7:12 Wasn’t going to go and listen to a lousy sermon
He’d read something either theologian or a good crime novel!
ODD CHILDHOOD
Never had a sleepover, only one boy girl party
7:39 Kept ourselves to ourselves
Went for amazing holidays (6 weeks)
8:03 Lots of discussions about ethics
8:21 We would debate these things quite furiously
8:31 And him looking a bit aghast (asking a bishop how he was so sure God was real!)
I am fearless I will say what I think needs to be said
SECOND DISC (THE SWINGLES)
8:54 I still love acapella when it’s mens’ voices singing
UNI OF MANCHESTER
Best at sciences and I liked people
10:20 Mother who said you’d better go off and do medicine then
In our family it wasn’t are you going to go to uni it was what are you going to do and which one
Was told not good enough for oxbridge or london so off I went to Manchester
10:38 Your imagination had been captured by John Watson’s book the double helix
10:49 The most beautiful design (DNA)
10:58 The basis of life
11:09 Made up of genes
11:15 Discovered this beautiful ladder that winds round itself
Went to interviews, why medicine? Because the double helix - it’s so beautiful! DNA is so fascinating I want to learn more
11:34 How did you fit in on campus?
11:46 Tried the university orchestra but they were a bit snotty
11:50 And I demonstrated, against Vietnam and things like that
Bit noisy, developing an elective period for students (Dean of medicine saying to her)
12:11 I’ve got you a scholarship, you’re going to Sweden for 3 months and we can have a bit of peace
THIRD DISC (THE WHO)
12:25 There was a Saturday night bop at the Student Union
JUNIOR DOCTOR (EARLY YEARS ON JOB)
13:34 Incredibly long hours
13:43 More intensive when they’re there and they’re pretty anti social (the hours for today’s young doctors)
13:51 I found it quite brutalising
Young woman in early 20s
13:58 Who’s kidneys had packed up
14:01 And we didn’t have enough dialysis machines
Drowned in the fluid in her own lungs
14:10 I was clearly quite sensitive
14:14 Top of the tree as Chief Medical Officer [LL]
TRAINING AND SUPPORT FOR YOUNG DOCTORS
Not happy
How many of them have consultants who know their names?
14:32 Rarely does anyone put a hand up
14:36 Because of the shift system we have young doctors working very heavy hours
14:43 and the pastoral support and the physical support has been taken out
Well trained but pastoral bit in England is not good enough
Consultants need time to provide the pastoral care
15:24 Braked too hard and did a 360 degree skid in front of the ward
15:31 I sat there feeling a bit shaken
He said ‘were you going to that interview?’, and he helped out car called and said he’ll call and say she’d do it the next day
→ Doesn’t happen anymore
15:48 Have to find more humanity in our staff
FOURTH DISC (QUEEN)
16:04 Goes back to my time in Spain
16:15 I was kept sane by an Englishman who taught me Spanish
DIPLOMAT’S WIFE
17:18 Not good as an appendage
Learnt how to ski, how to cook, how to speak Spanish
17:36 Looking back of course I learnt about diplomacy + civil service
17:47 Its been central to my success as CMO
REMARRIAGE
Philip had leukemia
You better do it quickly. Very sad
18:27 You must’ve had an extensive understanding of his condition
18:29 How did you cope
18:31 By just getting on with it
How bad society is about death
18:47 People kept me on an island of silence
Made me a better doctor I saw what it was like to be on the wrong side of medicine
18:59 I remember when they took him off chemotherapy and we took him home to die
People wouldn’t go into his room because they didn’t know what to say
19:16 The ones who went in and chatted to him, stood out
Interest in antimicrobial resistance came later because it was getting worse and worse
25,000 a year across Europe were dying from drug resistant infections
19:55 We have to give voice to this
19:57 Want the problem brought out into the open, on death certificates for example?
Want to be able to count patients
Need to look after antibiotics we’ve got
MOTHERHOOD
22.40 A lot of women give up (working)
Had to breastfeed while she was chairing a meeting. When she got angry or irritated, the baby would scream. Didn’t bother about what people thought - was very discreet - a loose top
OBESITY
25.53 said that obesity proved such a threat to women that it should be on a national risk register along with terrorist attacks and natural disasters.
26.40 The cancer research adverts depict a cigarette packet with the strapline ‘obesity is a form of cancer too’.
26.45 They have been heavily criticized for playing into a blame culture around obesity.
Cheaper for poor people to buy unhealthy food
27.53 How do we remove the stigma and the shame from that conversation (LL said that smoking is something that you DO but people ARE obese.)
Have to work with marketers but also have to be honest.
DSD - Need better weight management services - easier access in the community
29.00 Are they taking this advice on board? (LL asks what people’s reactions are)
Children’s obesity levels are doubling in primary school.
7th DISC ABBA
29.25 He and I crept off on our own one Saturday afternoon (Mama Mia - first time with 5 women)
PUBLIC CRITICISM
30.33 We’ve been talking about your plain speaking nature
30.45 Described as nanny in chief (by some colunmists)
30.59 it’s suggesting that I’m wagging my finger (actually giving advice)
Very sexist - the first women of CEO, what are they going to say to the man
Many of the complainants will have had nannies and benefitted from them
31.38 You’re embarking on a new challenge of the first female master of Trinity College Cambridge
32.01 We do need to think about diversity (poorer students, different races)
34.04 I’m about to cast you away to the picturesque solitude of your island.
34.35 What about a luxury item to help while away the hours?
35.16 an inexhaustible supply (bubble bath)